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Baseball America ranks the Astros Top 10 Prospects: Progress rather than perfection (and I'm ok with that)

Honestly, I was excited to read this.  I was excited to see where the experts at Baseball America ranked our fledging group of farmhands that, to us at least, should be propelling the Astros farm system into a respected status.  Instead, I was greeted with another reminder that it's easy to keeping kicking a man when they're down.

I'm not trying to say that I think Ben Balder was excessively harsh (really I don't think he was at all...just off on some of his criticism...but that's later), just that it stings sometimes when you have to view your hometown team the un-rose-tinted lens of an outsider.  As used this experience as all of us are, there were some issues I take with Balder's analysis of the farm system, and the Astros handling of it.

The main issue that Balder seems to take with the Astros is that they haven't accelerated this process enough. Balder points to the Rangers and the Athletics as models of how to revamp a farm system through dealing away talent to bring in prospects, but is achieving a great farm system ranking over night really the goal? Maybe. Since making those farm system altering deals, have the Atheltics and Rangers taken the AL West by storm? No. Not that I mean to imply that they can't soon be fielding excellent teams with the prospects they received, but it'll take them at least two to three years to do this—no?

Looking at the top 10 list of prospects Balder submits, just marvel at how many of those guys have Bobby Heck's finger prints on them:

1. Jason Castro, c
2. Jiovanni Mier, ss
3. Jordan Lyles, rhp
4. Sammy Gervacio, rhp
5. Chia-Jen Lo, rhp
6. Ross Seaton, rhp
7. Tanner Bushue, rhp
8. Jay Austin, of
9. Jon Gaston, of
10. T.J. Steele, of


Will it take another two years for us to see the fruit of Heck's labors, for the most part? Yes.  Will Castro and Lo likely make appearances in 2010? Yes.

I have no beef with the criticisms that Balder makes towards the way the organization has handled the draft over the last five years (seriously, they've screwed the pooch too many times), but I do think he's overly critical in a few areas. First,  while the Astros have lost several draft picks to free agent signings over the years, it's not like all of those signings are indefensible in the face of losing a first round pick.  Was Carlos Lee a good signing? No, but that's just because of the money they spend on him. Woody Williams? Hell no.  Preston Wilson? Also a no. But aside from those two signings, in the last seven years (the period of time Balder is critiquing) it's not like the Astros have just thrown away draft picks for Type A and B free agents.

The place I think Balder misses to critique the Astros organization is that they've lost out on so many opportunities for compensation picks via arbitration.  If we look back at that exact same period of time, we're out equally as many compensation picks, if not more.  That's how they could have hedged the risk they assumed with those signings, but they failed to hedge and are paying the price now.

The second thing that sightly rankles me, is that Balder makes it sound like the Astros had an easy fix this year at the trade deadline.  Assuming the Astros do trade Valverde and Hawkins, do they really just steal away so many prospects that produces a night and day difference for the farm system's ranking? Maybe...but I don't think it's as dramatic as Balder tries to portray it.

The Astros have themselves in a terrible plight as an organization, and it's of their own making.  Too few of their players take up too much payroll and have no trade clauses.  That's what's hamstringing them.  They really can't even pull of the kind of trades that Oakland and Texas did.  But, I also think one has to laud Heck and his department for continuing to deliver and shock the "consensus."  They're taking a methodical and less leveraged approach to rebuilding the organization from the ground up, which seems like the right—and only—way to do it; it's an approach the Balder even praises when referring the Brewers between 2001-2004.  

Could Ed Wade try a fire sale for prospects? Yes.  Is that guaranteed to make things better? Absolutely not.  There's no really proven track record with how to fix a farm system other than draft, sign, and develop quality prospects, which runs contrary to how Balder opens the article—so I guess I do have one beef with him.  Other than that, Bobby Heck still his work cut out for him, but looking at that list and Balder's evaluations of Heck's draftees, I have faith in the man.  Heck knows the game, and it's progress, rather than perfection.

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Comments

I agree with your points.

All of us can, and have, criticized the Astros’ organization. The truthful and accurate criticism is depressing enough, that it feels even worse when writers feel the need to exagerrate the criticism.

The Astros did not have any players with equivalent value to Texeira and Haren available for trading. They haven’t for several years. Texeira was a young impact star hitter with 1.5 years of cost control left when he was traded to the Braves. That would be like the Astros trading Lance Berkman four or five years ago. Haren was a young pitcher, who qualified as perhaps a top five starter in the majors, with a reasonable contract that placed him under team control for several years. If you trade someone like those players, you can get a huge haul of prospects. The Astros have older star players with big contracts and no trade clauses. They had good relievers who would be half year rentals, and they had older position players who would be half year rentals. The Astros traded one of those position players and got minor leaguers in return, but nobody who would even crack their own weak top 10 prospects. The idea that the Astros could have made huge advances with trades last summer is not realisitic.

I may be wrong, but I don’t think the Astros lost any draft picks for signing Preston Wilson.

Balder's points are fair

Aside from the Texeira and Haren comparisons, which Clack has already pointed out as being bad comparisons, I do think their was an opportunity for the Astros to add to the depth of minor league system at the deadline. They had several pieces they could of moved to snag a nice prospect, (Larry Anderson for Jeff Bagwell anyone?) and failed to do so. Now instead of getting something out of a Valverde, Tejada, or Hawkins The Astros could wind up with nothing. Having to decide whether to offer arbitration or not due to budgetary reasons, instead of having something concrete in the farm system, is a less than ideal situation to be in.

I have to agree… especially if they fail to offer arbitration, or offer arbitration and it’s accepted. Although, if they can get reasonable prices in arbitration they may be able to trade them for prospects anyway.

I was generally opposed to trading veterans at the deadline last year (except that I briefly suggested trading Hawkins when Valverde returned from the DL). No need to re-hash all of those arguments again. But part of my reasoning was that the players who might have value at the deadline would have more value in draft picks if arbitration was offered. I suspect that the Astros front office will screw up again by not offering arbitration…but I hope I am wrong. I’m not too bothered if any of the guys accept arbitration, because they all have value to the Astros (in terms of need) and they all will continue to have in-season trade value.

But the reason

We remember the Bagwell trade because it was a rarity. At the time, I think most were for holding pat at the deadline.

Like I said, I don’t disagree, I just think he’s overstating things, which isn’t fair to what the Astros are trying to accomplish.

I think people here forget that just because most of the additions have Heck's

finger prints on them does not mean that the system still isn’t a bottom 5 system. It is nice to see the focus on the draft, but none of the Lyles, Mier or Castro group is a true slam dunk difference maker. There have been a few questionable selections that are probably more $$ related than evaluation related, but the system could be a lot better than it currently is. The drafts have been good, but there is definite room for improvement.

As far as trades go, I think he hits it right on the head without blatantly stating what most Astros fans feel. If the team is not going to offer them arbitration the following off season, trade them at the deadline. At the break last year the team could have gotten some value for Tejeda instead of none if the Astros decline arbitration. Any player that would have been acquired from a team’s bottom 7 to 15 would slot in the 3-8 region right now. You add 2 or 3 guys like that and this system gains some respectability. Dealing Hawkins or Tejeda or Valverde would bring in guys in in the 6-10 range in other systems. That would have easily improved not only the depth the the upper end talent of the system.

The current review has 2 relievers in the top 5. That is indicative of how weak the system still is. Those are followed by 2 extremely young pitchers with projectability and 3 OF that have a combination of questions about their approach, injury history, and holes in their swing.

It is not just about totally revamping a system overnight, but at least pulling the system out of the bottom 5.

We could have gotten value

Bur not the kind of value that Balder implies. Those moves aren’t organization changers, but they COULD add value. Sure, it probably would have been better to trade at the deadline, but I think seeing what could happen with the seemingly wide open central was worth it.

Now, if we don’t offer arbitration to this year’s free agents…like I said, I’ll be out a phone or a laptop after I slam one into something when I find out.

The problem is the the Gagne and Lofton deals he sites

are the exact type of deals the Astros had the option to make. The return on those type of deals is the difference between a bottom 5 system and a middle of the pack system. A Hawkins or a Tejeda deal would be a move in the proper direction. Then if the team makes a major deal latter this off season the farm is rebuilt. Right now, even a blockbuster deal would not put this system into the top 5 and maybe not the top 10.

This system can’t be rebuilt overnight. It took 3 nice trades and 2 nice drafts to build the Texas system, and it was no where as bad as the Astro’s system was. Right now, the Astros have had 1 nice draft and 1 OK draft. There is a long long way to go, and unfortunately it is not something that can be fixed by just the draft. The system needs an influx of outside talent.

Think if it this way. The caliber of the 2 prospects Texas received or this years equivalents would have ranked in the Astros top 5 right now.

Everyone is smarter in hindsight

Valverde was the only one who would have brought middle tier prospects. Hawkins is aging and was performing so badly in NY before we got him that he was going to get sent to the minors so who’s to say that he wouldn’t be that bad somewhere else, he was a question mark. Tejada still had a large amount of money due to him that he wasn’t worth a rental. We were in it up to the trade deadline, in fact we were rolling the week before with a sweep over the cards in St. Louis. Yes, we should have dealt one or more but everyone is smarter in hindsight. I can guarantee had we made the playoffs you wouldn’t be making that same statement. As far as trading one of them making us middle of the pack…probably not. We’d still be in the 20s as far as organizational rankings.

Actually I was clmoring for them to blow it up to begin the season last year, much less at the deadline.

Hawkins, Valverede or Tejeda would all have brought at least 1 prospect off of a teams top 10 list. Valverede may have brought more than that.

3 prospects from other teams top 10’s would bring this thing from the bottom 5 to the middle 10 to 20 range.

I seriously doubt that any of those guys would have brought a top 10 prospect in a mid season trade last year. Of course, it’s not worth arguing over, because none of us know. Rafael Betancourt was traded by the Indians to the Rockies around mid season, and the Indians received this minor league pitcher in return, and he wasn’t a top 10 type prospect.

speaking of draft and developing

who do you want the astros to draft with the number 8 pick?

me i’m hoping for jameson tallion

I don't think Tallion will fall that far. He proably goes in the top 5 if not top 3.

My personal favorite is Zach Cox, which I expect to stay at 3B. IF it looks like he won’t stick at 3B i would like to grab a LH college arm like Drew Pomeranz or Chris Sale.

There is enough youth that a few college arms might balance the system some and give it some need polish to go with the influx of youth.

I don’t know a whole lot about the prospects yet, but the little research I’ve done so far has me leaning toward Zack Cox (3B), as mentioned, or Christian Colon (SS), both reportedly solid college infield guys.

I’d also like to see them draft Craig Fitsch. He won’t go in the first round, and may not want to sign next season, so that’ll be up to the front office to figure out. But my wife tutored him at Baylor, and he apparently throws low-90s with a good slider. He was drafted by the Tigers this year but didn’t sign, as far as I know.

any news on jose valdez, from what i can tell he has had a pretty solid minor league career as a minor league reliever, but i really have no idea

I posted as much as I could find on him in the story above this one
Christian Colon

I’m high on him and hope we draft him at #8 if he’s still there. Playing SS in college but many think he’ll end up at 2nd base. From what I’ve read … seems like a gritty, all out player who’s skills are good across the board but nothing really stands out as Great. the last time we had a gritty, all out 2nd baseman it worked out pretty well for the ‘stros. We have no other decent prospect at 2nd and I think it’d be great fun to watch Mier and Colon play at MMP for the next decade.

Yes, Colon is very interesting. There is some doubt about his tools, but scouts seem to universally love his makeup.

I’m also interested in Rick Hague, a shortstop out of Rice. He doesn’t seem to have as much consensus surrounding him as Colon, but he could be a first-rounder, though more likely a supplemental sandwich pick or second round.

Gritty

I miss FJM =(

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